Assignment: In Sixty Million Frenchmen Can't Be Wrong, readChapter 9 (omit Ch. 8) . Write a response, following the
Reader Response Guidelines (above). React to and comment upon
at least 2 of your classmates responses.
France has a great love for Charles de Gaulle because he was the reason that France was brought back to life after World War II. While he was exiled he had a wonderful opportunity to think of ways to redo the French constitution and to fix the reoccurring issues with the government. Despite being forced to wait to put these plans into action, he eventually did. Like Great Britain, France used to give most of the power to parliament and the prime minster, but Charles de Gaulle felt that a president should hold the power. He then gave many powers to this president that included the right to dissolve parliament, sit in on cabinet meetings, and be able to change or add to the constitution with a referendum. There is also no limit on the number of years that a president can serve and the president cannot be impeached. This new government has worked for France ever since. Charles de Gaulle most likely saved this nation from tearing itself apart in the future. Were his ways to absolutism? I would say that is highly debatable because there are checks and balances in this system, maybe not to the same degree that the United States has, but they are there. I would say that there are touches of absolutism in the way that the president can bypass parliament, but then again the people elect the president into office. This aspect I truly like because in our system it is the Electoral College that holds most if not all of the power. The people have come together to decide on the best leader for France, which truly makes France a democracy. The president could also be president until death, but he would have to be reelected each time. I do worry that not being able to impeach the president might have been too much of an absolutism move.
I also like the fact that the French people elect their president into office. It's a true democracy. It makes for a more accurate representation of the people. I actually like that the president could potentially remain president until death. If a country is on the right track, it seems counter-productive to start all over with someone new.
I was also worried about the fact that impeachment of the president isn't allowed, because if the president is making bad decisions, the country would have to wait until the next election.
I find that it is a true democracy also! I would love to learn about how they implement this tactic. It balances out the over-exertion of power that the president is allotted.
This chapter was all about the war in Algeria. In the book the authors compared this war to the Vietnam war with the US. France’s involvement with Algeria started because France wanted to police the pirates in the Mediterranean. France then saw that Algeria had “rich agricultural shore” and wanted to expand its territory to Algeria. So the French pushed the Muslims out of the way and Europeans settled in. Because the Muslim’s religion was seen to not mix well with French culture, the Muslims were discriminated against and were not given French citizenship. The Muslim’s did not receive education and was used for labor. They were basically slaves on their own land. All this cumulated into the hate fire that eventually resulted in war. Although the French bigger numbers, Algeria still ended up winning. Algeria won their independence. It’s amazing how so many people in France were so against the war but it was still going on. If the French wanted to give Algeria more privileges they should have ended the war and made it clear. Instead they let their people still fight. I am starting to think that the French don’t make the best decisions. At least they didn’t hide this war from the public like they did with WWII.
It is really quite awful that the French discriminated against the Muslim com minty just like they did to their Jewish community during World War II. These events really do not bode well for France's appearance to the rest of the world.
This chapter talks about the power and influence that Charles de Gaulle had over France, specifically after World War II. He believed that there should be one person with absolute authority, and believed that power distribution made the country weak. He was elected as the president and eventually was exiled for four years, and had a lot of time to reflect on how to make change happen. He came back into power and completely revamped the government system, allowing the president to have authority over parliament (to dissolve them) and power to edit the constitution. Interestingly enough, de Gaulle also made it to where the president can technically stay in power for the rest of their life. He also changed the system of voting, where there is a first round of voting, which people usually vote based on appeal of the person running. The second round happens if there wasn’t a clear winner in the first, and since there are a minimum number of votes, many of the smaller parties are eliminated by the second round. I think this is interesting, because one person may gain many votes the first time, but will not survive the second time. I also think it’s interesting that the president doesn’t have a time limit to staying in power, which can be a good thing, because they can continue to make changes while in power without the country worrying if the next person would mess it all up because of a time limit.
I loved de Gaulle's voting system. I wish that the United States would implement this two round election system because it guarantees that there will be a clear winner of the majority of the votes.
I think de Gaulle did a really stellar job in getting France back on their feet after the brutal first have of the 20th century. He was the perfect man for the job. I too found it cool that a French president could potentially serve for life. In fact it intrigued me so much that I wanted to learn more and looked it up, and I found out they changed the constitution in 2002 and made it so that a president couldn't serve more than two consecutive terms. Still, i think the fifth Republic has some good things going for it.
Sean M. Taylor French 101 October 23, 2014 Reader Response #8 How is French state absolutist? Chapter Nine dealt with the “Penchant for Absolutism” of France. The authors exemplify this characteristic of France by telling the story of, first General, then President de Gaulle. During World War II de Gaulle attempted to lead the French state in a resistance against Germany; however, the idea had been unpopular so he retreated into London and from there led the Free France resistance. After World War II had ended, de Gaulle was appointed head of France’s government. De Gaulle seized this opportunity and rewrote the French Constitution. In this constitution he created, “a presidential regime where the president would have the power to dissolve Parliament, appoint the prime minister, preside over cabinet meetings, and appoint representatives in each Département.” This constitution was approved by 78 percent of the French population thereby making it a way to break Parliament and make it possible for a single leader to exercise power. This inevitably made the president the supreme judge, just like kings of France’s past. As the book said, “The French, it seems, can’t resist making kings.” In addition, there are only three checks that keep the French president from being a total dictator: he must be elected by the majority of the French population, he must obey the laws of the country, and he must follow the Constitution. All of this adds to giving the president and almost absolute power over the French state.
I found it interesting to see the contrast between democracy in the United States and France. Such different interpretations of the same governmental structure. I wonder why the French "can't resist making kings."
Honestly, it's probably a good thing in some senses to have a leader with more absolute power. In the United States we are at a point were hardly anything gets done politically because of all the infighting in the House of representatives and the Senate. They spend all day arguing with the other side they forget their true jobs, to compromise and to govern. If the president had more authority we could get a lot more done in half the time. Also, we are at an age in American culture were information flies so rapidly it would hard to be an oppressive tyrannical president unless you wanted a coup on your hands. There will never be a perfect political system but I think France is doing a decent job.
Chapter 9 addressed the French people’s “Penchant for Absolutism.” It told the story of General Charles de Gaulle and his tremendous influence on French government and society. According to the text, “de Gaulle is the man who restored their nation’s grandeur after the country was humiliated and almost torn apart by civil war during World War II.” He single-handedly imposed a reform of democratic institutions following World War II and also during the War of Algeria. His story began in 1940 when Germany defeated France. He refused the armistice that conservative generals were promoting, and exiled himself to London. There he was recognized as the leader of Free France. After four years in exile, de Gaulle came up with a plan to revitalize France’s morale, government, and economy. The main idea behind de Gaulle’s new Constitution was to break the power of Parliament and allow for a single leader to exercise power. De Gaulle “took the fundamental weakness of the French and turned it into strength.” I found it very interesting to see the contrast between democracy in the United States and democracy in France. I also found it interesting to see how important political legitimacy is in France. The president in France is elected by the people rather than an electoral college like it is in the United States.
You're absolutely right, it is interesting to see that contrast between democracy here and there. I know many here in the United States are not in favor of the electoral college because they feel it is not direct democracy. de Gaulle's resolution to reform democracy makes a lot of sense.
Charles de Gaulle was a hero in the eyes of the French because he restored the nation’s grandeur after the country was humiliated. In 1940 when Germany had defeated France in the Battle of France, the Germans were pushing the government to sign the armistice but de Gaulle refused. He exiled himself to London for 4 years and during that time he came up with a plan to help restore France’s political system and its economy. He was elected prime minister by the Parliament but the next day he was given full power and was asked to change the constitution. The main purpose of Gaulle's new constitution was to break the power of Parliament and have one single leader exercise power. It was a bit hard to change the minds of the French to accept the new constitution but eventually they accepted it. Just like the president of the United States, they have real power but unlike the French presidency he can't dissolve the assembly and call a new election of Congress members. There are a few differences between the two president but overall they have the real power unlike the kings of Belgium, Spain and Great Britain who are just figureheads while the Prime Minister possess the real power. France seemed to change and gain their power back from Germany thanks to de Gaulle. He helped his country gain their power back and change for the best. He is a true hero and he's legacy still is alive among the Frenchman.
I think that was an ingenious plan to remove himself from France at the time to plan for a few years. The plan was effective and I believe that taking that time to be away from the humiliation and depressive state that many were in made all the difference.
In this chapter we take a closer look at a War that I did not know even happened- the War of Algeria. There’s a reason the title of this chapter is the Unacknowledged War and not the forgotten war. The French remember this war of 1956-1957 very well. For those who were heavily involved in French military, this war can be compared to the Vietnam war. It was humiliating to say the least. The French sent out 1.3 million troops to Algeria who has only 330,000 and in the end, France still lost. France does not do well with defeat. So as I learned in this chapter, the topic of the Algerian War is taboo. It doesn’t come up in conversation because it’s like the elephant in the room that everyone knows is there, but if you say it’s there then you must deal with your response to it. Compared to World War II’s losses, Algeria is way worse and effective in hurting France’s pride. I would say that this war was the result of Algerian nationalism and the push for entitlement, which is never a good thing. This is the root of wars between countries when you think about because there is always a sense of deserving something that you’re not receiving.
France has a great love for Charles de Gaulle because he was the reason that France was brought back to life after World War II. While he was exiled he had a wonderful opportunity to think of ways to redo the French constitution and to fix the reoccurring issues with the government. Despite being forced to wait to put these plans into action, he eventually did. Like Great Britain, France used to give most of the power to parliament and the prime minster, but Charles de Gaulle felt that a president should hold the power. He then gave many powers to this president that included the right to dissolve parliament, sit in on cabinet meetings, and be able to change or add to the constitution with a referendum. There is also no limit on the number of years that a president can serve and the president cannot be impeached. This new government has worked for France ever since. Charles de Gaulle most likely saved this nation from tearing itself apart in the future. Were his ways to absolutism? I would say that is highly debatable because there are checks and balances in this system, maybe not to the same degree that the United States has, but they are there. I would say that there are touches of absolutism in the way that the president can bypass parliament, but then again the people elect the president into office. This aspect I truly like because in our system it is the Electoral College that holds most if not all of the power. The people have come together to decide on the best leader for France, which truly makes France a democracy. The president could also be president until death, but he would have to be reelected each time. I do worry that not being able to impeach the president might have been too much of an absolutism move.
RépondreSupprimerI also like the fact that the French people elect their president into office. It's a true democracy. It makes for a more accurate representation of the people. I actually like that the president could potentially remain president until death. If a country is on the right track, it seems counter-productive to start all over with someone new.
SupprimerI was also worried about the fact that impeachment of the president isn't allowed, because if the president is making bad decisions, the country would have to wait until the next election.
SupprimerI find that it is a true democracy also! I would love to learn about how they implement this tactic. It balances out the over-exertion of power that the president is allotted.
SupprimerThis chapter was all about the war in Algeria. In the book the authors compared this war to the Vietnam war with the US. France’s involvement with Algeria started because France wanted to police the pirates in the Mediterranean. France then saw that Algeria had “rich agricultural shore” and wanted to expand its territory to Algeria. So the French pushed the Muslims out of the way and Europeans settled in. Because the Muslim’s religion was seen to not mix well with French culture, the Muslims were discriminated against and were not given French citizenship. The Muslim’s did not receive education and was used for labor. They were basically slaves on their own land. All this cumulated into the hate fire that eventually resulted in war. Although the French bigger numbers, Algeria still ended up winning. Algeria won their independence. It’s amazing how so many people in France were so against the war but it was still going on. If the French wanted to give Algeria more privileges they should have ended the war and made it clear. Instead they let their people still fight. I am starting to think that the French don’t make the best decisions. At least they didn’t hide this war from the public like they did with WWII.
RépondreSupprimerCe commentaire a été supprimé par l'auteur.
SupprimerIt is really quite awful that the French discriminated against the Muslim com minty just like they did to their Jewish community during World War II. These events really do not bode well for France's appearance to the rest of the world.
SupprimerThis chapter talks about the power and influence that Charles de Gaulle had over France, specifically after World War II. He believed that there should be one person with absolute authority, and believed that power distribution made the country weak. He was elected as the president and eventually was exiled for four years, and had a lot of time to reflect on how to make change happen. He came back into power and completely revamped the government system, allowing the president to have authority over parliament (to dissolve them) and power to edit the constitution. Interestingly enough, de Gaulle also made it to where the president can technically stay in power for the rest of their life. He also changed the system of voting, where there is a first round of voting, which people usually vote based on appeal of the person running. The second round happens if there wasn’t a clear winner in the first, and since there are a minimum number of votes, many of the smaller parties are eliminated by the second round. I think this is interesting, because one person may gain many votes the first time, but will not survive the second time. I also think it’s interesting that the president doesn’t have a time limit to staying in power, which can be a good thing, because they can continue to make changes while in power without the country worrying if the next person would mess it all up because of a time limit.
RépondreSupprimerI loved de Gaulle's voting system. I wish that the United States would implement this two round election system because it guarantees that there will be a clear winner of the majority of the votes.
SupprimerI agree, I like how the French citizens vote for their president, not an electoral college that has the power to vote which ever way it chooses.
SupprimerI think de Gaulle did a really stellar job in getting France back on their feet after the brutal first have of the 20th century. He was the perfect man for the job. I too found it cool that a French president could potentially serve for life. In fact it intrigued me so much that I wanted to learn more and looked it up, and I found out they changed the constitution in 2002 and made it so that a president couldn't serve more than two consecutive terms. Still, i think the fifth Republic has some good things going for it.
SupprimerSean M. Taylor
RépondreSupprimerFrench 101
October 23, 2014
Reader Response #8
How is French state absolutist?
Chapter Nine dealt with the “Penchant for Absolutism” of France. The authors exemplify this characteristic of France by telling the story of, first General, then President de Gaulle. During World War II de Gaulle attempted to lead the French state in a resistance against Germany; however, the idea had been unpopular so he retreated into London and from there led the Free France resistance. After World War II had ended, de Gaulle was appointed head of France’s government. De Gaulle seized this opportunity and rewrote the French Constitution. In this constitution he created, “a presidential regime where the president would have the power to dissolve Parliament, appoint the prime minister, preside over cabinet meetings, and appoint representatives in each Département.” This constitution was approved by 78 percent of the French population thereby making it a way to break Parliament and make it possible for a single leader to exercise power. This inevitably made the president the supreme judge, just like kings of France’s past. As the book said, “The French, it seems, can’t resist making kings.” In addition, there are only three checks that keep the French president from being a total dictator: he must be elected by the majority of the French population, he must obey the laws of the country, and he must follow the Constitution. All of this adds to giving the president and almost absolute power over the French state.
I found it interesting to see the contrast between democracy in the United States and France. Such different interpretations of the same governmental structure. I wonder why the French "can't resist making kings."
SupprimerHonestly, it's probably a good thing in some senses to have a leader with more absolute power. In the United States we are at a point were hardly anything gets done politically because of all the infighting in the House of representatives and the Senate. They spend all day arguing with the other side they forget their true jobs, to compromise and to govern. If the president had more authority we could get a lot more done in half the time. Also, we are at an age in American culture were information flies so rapidly it would hard to be an oppressive tyrannical president unless you wanted a coup on your hands. There will never be a perfect political system but I think France is doing a decent job.
SupprimerChapter 9 addressed the French people’s “Penchant for Absolutism.” It told the story of General Charles de Gaulle and his tremendous influence on French government and society. According to the text, “de Gaulle is the man who restored their nation’s grandeur after the country was humiliated and almost torn apart by civil war during World War II.” He single-handedly imposed a reform of democratic institutions following World War II and also during the War of Algeria. His story began in 1940 when Germany defeated France. He refused the armistice that conservative generals were promoting, and exiled himself to London. There he was recognized as the leader of Free France. After four years in exile, de Gaulle came up with a plan to revitalize France’s morale, government, and economy. The main idea behind de Gaulle’s new Constitution was to break the power of Parliament and allow for a single leader to exercise power. De Gaulle “took the fundamental weakness of the French and turned it into strength.” I found it very interesting to see the contrast between democracy in the United States and democracy in France. I also found it interesting to see how important political legitimacy is in France. The president in France is elected by the people rather than an electoral college like it is in the United States.
RépondreSupprimerYou're absolutely right, it is interesting to see that contrast between democracy here and there. I know many here in the United States are not in favor of the electoral college because they feel it is not direct democracy. de Gaulle's resolution to reform democracy makes a lot of sense.
SupprimerCharles de Gaulle was a hero in the eyes of the French because he restored the nation’s grandeur after the country was humiliated. In 1940 when Germany had defeated France in the Battle of France, the Germans were pushing the government to sign the armistice but de Gaulle refused. He exiled himself to London for 4 years and during that time he came up with a plan to help restore France’s political system and its economy. He was elected prime minister by the Parliament but the next day he was given full power and was asked to change the constitution. The main purpose of Gaulle's new constitution was to break the power of Parliament and have one single leader exercise power. It was a bit hard to change the minds of the French to accept the new constitution but eventually they accepted it. Just like the president of the United States, they have real power but unlike the French presidency he can't dissolve the assembly and call a new election of Congress members. There are a few differences between the two president but overall they have the real power unlike the kings of Belgium, Spain and Great Britain who are just figureheads while the Prime Minister possess the real power. France seemed to change and gain their power back from Germany thanks to de Gaulle. He helped his country gain their power back and change for the best. He is a true hero and he's legacy still is alive among the Frenchman.
RépondreSupprimerI think that was an ingenious plan to remove himself from France at the time to plan for a few years. The plan was effective and I believe that taking that time to be away from the humiliation and depressive state that many were in made all the difference.
SupprimerIn this chapter we take a closer look at a War that I did not know even happened- the War of Algeria. There’s a reason the title of this chapter is the Unacknowledged War and not the forgotten war. The French remember this war of 1956-1957 very well. For those who were heavily involved in French military, this war can be compared to the Vietnam war. It was humiliating to say the least. The French sent out 1.3 million troops to Algeria who has only 330,000 and in the end, France still lost. France does not do well with defeat. So as I learned in this chapter, the topic of the Algerian War is taboo. It doesn’t come up in conversation because it’s like the elephant in the room that everyone knows is there, but if you say it’s there then you must deal with your response to it. Compared to World War II’s losses, Algeria is way worse and effective in hurting France’s pride. I would say that this war was the result of Algerian nationalism and the push for entitlement, which is never a good thing. This is the root of wars between countries when you think about because there is always a sense of deserving something that you’re not receiving.
RépondreSupprimer